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 Post subject: Re: Some Clown Locked The Topic
PostPosted: Wed Aug 24, 2011 10:25 am 
Lieutenant Major
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So, is this what you guys want?

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 Post subject: Re: Some Clown Locked The Topic
PostPosted: Wed Aug 24, 2011 10:26 am 
Second Lieutenant
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Seth wrote:
Seth wrote:
Maybe I should try an experiment. Next era on E4, maybe I should completely overlook any form of colony slavery.

Why not? Let's try it. As long as I cannot prove definitively that it is a multi account, anything goes. That will be fun, right? Lets turn it into a battle of who can recruit the most "friends" on short notice at strategically opportune times and places.

Also, why not Conquer them too! Have them serve as hubs for your your spam and spy attacks as well as nukes all the while you can keep them conquered, friend or not! You get the cake and eat it too!

Im game if you are. Lets do it.

If this is how the community wants it, lets do it.



Sorry. Just wanted to make sure you Got this too Oluvai.


I got it. I saw it.

And YEP. Indeed. I expect and DEMAND you act when you HAVE A rule violation. Not when you think one could possibly exist at some point down the road. Not when you suspect something, but can't prove.

Absolutely, the ENTIRE game community wants to STOP seeing you take action on things you don't know, can't prove, are allowed by game mechanics AND rules and are often taken because you FEEL something's amiss.

I would LOVE an era where you only took action against clear rule violations you could prove. It would be fantastic.


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 Post subject: Re: Some Clown Locked The Topic
PostPosted: Wed Aug 24, 2011 10:26 am 
First Lieutenant
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Seth wrote:
Hell, why not? It won't make things harder on me, thats for sure!

These folks are treating me like I do this sort of thing because it is good for my health. :lol: Like I get a kick out of having to go up against all of you folks to defend my actions.

Lets try an era where anything goes. Lets see what happens when I completely reserve my judgement and only respond to messages regarding technical issues or learning resources. Cant hurt anything, right? Especially since my judgement is so bad.



This would put things into perspective. They'll be whining for you to intervene.

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 Post subject: Re: Some Clown Locked The Topic
PostPosted: Wed Aug 24, 2011 10:32 am 
Second Lieutenant
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Seth wrote:
Hell, why not? It won't make things harder on me, thats for sure!

These folks are treating me like I do this sort of thing because it is good for my health. :lol: Like I get a kick out of having to go up against all of you folks to defend my actions.

Lets try an era where anything goes. Lets see what happens when I completely reserve my judgement and only respond to messages regarding technical issues or learning resources. Cant hurt anything, right? Especially since my judgement is so bad.




No, Seth.

This is not exactly true. I've dealt with you privately and when asked to privately defend your actions, you are combative, smug, arrogant, somewhat impolite and you act as if you are doing me a favor even listening to me and taking your time.

Now, this is the first time I've seen you forced into public. Here, I find you to be combative, smug, arrogant, somewhat impolite and you act as if your actions are so valuable and necessary you're doing us all a favor.

So, I believe that's who you are.

I have NO doubt you believe it is legitimate to deploy your power to take action against people for no actual rule violations, but for your anticipated possible down the road rule violations. And I suspect you are ACTUALLY the only one who thinks it is legitimate.

No one is asking for an "anything goes" era.

We are asking you to do YOUR job.

Allow the game to be played.

Take action against those who break the rules and YOU can prove have.

AND, BEFORE you take action, talk to that person, and assure you have given them fair hearing in case there's an explanation you were not prepared for.

Now, this last may be too hard for you as you do not believe people as your earlier post mentioned. So, just do the first two. Stay out of the eras way unless YOU see a clear rule violation. One that does not require you to suggest a person who's spent $1000 on an era is farming by taking a crystal from a former member.

One that does not require you to predict a future rule violation.

One that actually is clear.

Are you the only one who doesn't know what farming is?


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 Post subject: Re: Some Clown Locked The Topic
PostPosted: Wed Aug 24, 2011 10:40 am 
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Seth, show them what an era would be like with no admin action. no discounts, no multis getting banned, no settling of disputes, no farms being deleted, no relics spawned, no wreckages, no UFOs, etc. they'll admit that they're wrong within 500 ticks

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 Post subject: Re: Some Clown Locked The Topic
PostPosted: Wed Aug 24, 2011 10:42 am 
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Double post.

Seth.

You've taken the debate and have attempted to steer it away from what you did, to what you perceive as a punishment against all game players in a future era in some vain attempt to validate just how important and crucial you are.

What we're addressing is the fact you have openly admitted to banning people YOU have said yourself broke no actual rule, but you anticipated eventually would. You have admitted yourself you GUESSED those gate colonies would disappear eventually and have legitimized your actions.

Once you see a challenge to your style, you ignore the challenge, and suggest instead of taking action against obvious, clear rule-breakers, you'll do nothing and show just how important you are.

I'd recommend you take a step back and appreciate there's a middle ground.

One that removes your anticipatory skills from the mix. One that entirely removes your precognition senses and simply applies the rules on violators when they violate and not until.

You can be a good admin by banning multis and stopping farming groups without getting in the way of the game itself. No one would even notice you if you just did the things which are obvious to all. If you can't prove a multi because they use proxy servers, well, good for them. They are smarter than you.

Leave 'em.

Or, watch them closely. Wait for an IP error, or build a case by their timestamps of activity, and then present it to the person and ask them to defend against it. Give them a moment to talk to you. But stop getting involved in the game until someone does something wrong.

You've got the easiest job in the world.

You should be invisible. Active, honest players should NEVER see you. Yet we always do.


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 Post subject: Re: Some Clown Locked The Topic
PostPosted: Wed Aug 24, 2011 10:43 am 
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Seth has his reasons. he doesn't need to share them with you. who are you to judge how he does his job?

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 Post subject: Re: Some Clown Locked The Topic
PostPosted: Wed Aug 24, 2011 10:48 am 
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Maolain wrote:
Seth, show them what an era would be like with no admin action. no discounts, no multis getting banned, no settling of disputes, no farms being deleted, no relics spawned, no wreckages, no UFOs, etc. they'll admit that they're wrong within 500 ticks


Great idea.

Don't enforce game rules at all. Ignore them altogether. Do nothing. That's always a way to show how important the game rules are to enforce. How about we just agree the game rules are important to enforce and not worry about an era where the admin ignores them?

How about asking the admin to enforce them and otherwise get out of the way and enforce them when they are broken, not before, and not in ways which are wildly questionable?

Why is this so difficult?

Quote:
Seth has his reasons. he doesn't need to share them with you. who are you to judge how he does his job?


Actually, indeed, Seth does need to share his reasons with me and the entire game community. Seth can't play an era alone. Players comprise the game. Our spending allows the enterprise to flourish. I should not be the judge of how he does his job. Michael should.

I should merely help Seth achieve a better balance between maintaining the rules and avoiding the Seth persona he cherishes which allows him to harm the game by punishing people who've done ZERO wrong on a whim he has they might one day do something he doesn't like, whether that is actually wrong or not.

Seth has admitted HERE to punishing people who did nothing wrong based on his thoughts they might eventually.

I ask you, isn't the real question why aren't YOU asking Seth to explain how he does his job, when he's already explained he does it based on feel, not evidence?


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 Post subject: Re: Some Clown Locked The Topic
PostPosted: Wed Aug 24, 2011 10:50 am 
Major
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We are people who pay 1000 dollars a round, effectively paying his salary and funding the game. We have EVERY right to question.

BTW Maolain, what is with the stupid comments? I was about to post harshly, but since you are a friend, I didnt. Read what Oluvai wrote. He didnt say, dont ban multies, dont ban people that farm etc. He simply said, ban when you have proof, when you KNOW people did something wrong. And also give them a fair chance to explain themselves. And dont ban people if you dont have proof, or if you just think they MAY violate rules later on. That is not by any means unfair and to think you cannot call out an admins decision, is your misunderstanding. Come on.

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 Post subject: Re: Some Clown Locked The Topic
PostPosted: Wed Aug 24, 2011 10:54 am 
Second Lieutenant
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oh so like D3AN from E3? yeah. I just went there

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