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 Post subject: Re: Cheating and multi accounts.
PostPosted: Fri Nov 27, 2009 3:43 pm 
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simmen wrote:
i'm just finding loopholes in the rules just as with subs ;)
there say NOTHING in the rules there is not allowed to make a colony then send resources to some one as long as they don't ask for it, look it up ;)

Quote:
2.2.5. Loopholes: You shall not attempt to manipulate or circumvent Services or use loopholes in them; furthermore, You shall report any loopholes or means for circumvention immediately to a Game Administrator.

Quote:
Quote:
and/or acquiring Game Resources in order to sell them to other Users in exchange for cash, payment or other benefits;


no payment can be proven and none have happened, so this don't count ether


Payment or 'other benefits' - other benefits can simply be a favour to a friend, so yes, they are still guilty.

Simmen, you are not going to change anything, I am simply explaining why they were banned, they did break the rules, regardless of whether you agree with that or not.

3 reasons for a ban:
1. The ability of supporters to trade resources was never meant to be used in this way, this is abuse of a loophole in the game to do something that you were never meant to be able to do - abusing loopholes/bugs is bannable.

2. The reasons I have stated already, in the rules - bannable.

3. Even if the loophole you think you found held water (it doesn't), abusing loopholes is also bannable



If you're still struggling with the concept, look at it like this.

The rules are there to warn you, if you find a way to cheat in a way that is not included in the rules, you can still be banned for doing it.

Our priority is to ensure fun, fair play for the players of BattleDawn, if somebody is cheating then they can expect us to hammer down on them, period.

Call me unfair, call me whatever you like, at the end of the day, I am here to protect you.

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 Post subject: Re: Cheating and multi accounts.
PostPosted: Fri Nov 27, 2009 3:52 pm 
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subs are loopholes from alliance limits, never seen any banned, and "helping a friend" is not really a benefit for the player?

1. it were never meant to be that way, but neither were the ability to put a number behind their alliance and calling themself a sub, but i see no reaction
2. as i stated the player really gained nothing, unless you can prove that?
3. i'm informing you about the loophole, not used it

and look at this this way, the rules are saying what is allowed and what is not, correct?
it's not saying you can't make a colony and send, and it does not say you can't gain unless you ask for it, "helping a friend" is not gaining anything other then maby a good feeling.

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 Post subject: Re: Cheating and multi accounts.
PostPosted: Fri Nov 27, 2009 3:59 pm 
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Quote:
subs are loopholes from alliance limits, never seen any banned, and "helping a friend" is not really a benefit for the player?


Michael has stated himself that he dislikes subbing, but accepts them as an evil that will always occur, since they are essentially just close allies.

Quote:
2. as i stated the player really gained nothing, unless you can prove that?


The receiving player unfairly gained resources - ban
The sending player allowed the receiving player to unfairly gain resources- ban

Quote:
3. i'm informing you about the loophole, not used it

They used it - ban

Quote:
and look at this this way, the rules are saying what is allowed and what is not, correct?


The rules tell you what not to do, not us what to enforce - if cheaters find a new way of cheating, we will still ban for it.

Quote:
it's not saying you can't make a colony and send, and it does not say you can't gain unless you ask for it, "helping a friend" is not gaining anything other then maby a good feeling.


Loophole is the rules, as long as there is unfair play/cheating involved, we will still ban.

Setting up a colony purely to use the ability of donators to send resources is a loophole in the game, which, alone, is enough to ban.

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 Post subject: Re: Cheating and multi accounts.
PostPosted: Fri Nov 27, 2009 4:14 pm 
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Routhy wrote:
Quote:
subs are loopholes from alliance limits, never seen any banned, and "helping a friend" is not really a benefit for the player?


Michael has stated himself that he dislikes subbing, but accepts them as an evil that will always occur, since they are essentially just close allies.
but they are not just close allies, they are innfact subs, they ignollege it and as long as it's legal it can continue, but if michael have said that then ok, it's hes game, and since there are not rules against it, it got to be legal right? just like this..

Quote:
2. as i stated the player really gained nothing, unless you can prove that?


The receiving player unfairly gained resources - ban
The sending player allowed the receiving player to unfairly gain resources- ban

so if having to quit a round then sending resources to some one is reciving unfair gained resources?
and there does not say in any of your earlier points anything against a player sending he's resources unless he's sending to himself to gain anything

Quote:
3. i'm informing you about the loophole, not used it

They used it - ban
i know they got the bann, not that i'm arguing about, i say that rules shuld be changed so this is now longer by the rules legal..

Quote:
and look at this this way, the rules are saying what is allowed and what is not, correct?


The rules tell you what not to do, not us what to enforce - if cheaters find a new way of cheating, we will still ban for it.
if cheaters find a new way of cheating you make rules against it, no rules, no bann.. well in this case it were


Quote:
it's not saying you can't make a colony and send, and it does not say you can't gain unless you ask for it, "helping a friend" is not gaining anything other then maby a good feeling.


Loophole is the rules, as long as there is unfair play/cheating involved, we will still ban.

Setting up a colony purely to use the ability of donators to send resources is a loophole in the game, which, alone, is enough to ban.

who are you to say what is unfair? having a sub empire with 100 colonys controlled by 1 alliance is not fair ether, but yet legal..which i'm sure everyone is ok with as long as there is no rules against it.. just like this.

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 Post subject: Re: Cheating and multi accounts.
PostPosted: Fri Nov 27, 2009 4:29 pm 
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This is already in the rules, as I have stated:

Quote:
and/or acquiring Game Resources in order to sell them to other Users in exchange for cash, payment or other benefits;


You kept focusing on the 'cash' part, so I'll repeat what I said earlier - 'other benefits' can simply include a favour to/from a friend.

We're done here, I have explained why they were banned, and which rules they were banned over. I've also shown the Loophole policy which covers anything that isn't explicitly inside of the rules.

If you want the rules to be changed, PM an ingame admin with your suggestion, I have said everything I am going to say here. What I am posting is not my personal opinion, it's the hard facts about this case, so arguing it isn't going to do anything except force me to repeat myself.

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 Post subject: Re: Cheating and multi accounts.
PostPosted: Fri Nov 27, 2009 5:10 pm 
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The bans have been explained and the arguments against are being repeated.
If you have anymore complaints against these bans, please contact the admin in the world in which these bans were issued.

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